"Python/PHP is the same shit"

今天跟别人聊天，我问他，Python是不是应该比PHP快，他说:

"python/php is the same shit. it's still an interpreted language python or php work the same way: scan source, compile in bytecode, run bytecode. java works that way too, but can run some optimizations at compile time since compilation do not have to happen at each run. but python/perl/php are the same shit (ruby too) " MagicalTux (Google) @ 3:33

然后他又说：

"if you can run non-compiled files, it means it's slow. that's all. however this "slow" usually involves a few ms, while your own errors can cost way more. what's really important is not to choose a language because it is "fast" or not, but choose a language because you "master" it"

大家有什么看法

same

run

Way

28 条回复 • 1970-01-01 08:00:00 +08:00

keakon

2011-01-03 10:43:15 +08:00

Actually, for most web apps, language is not the bottleneck.
Rendering an page normally costs less than 10ms, while the database accessing and network latency are much more expansive than it (maybe hundreds or thousand ms).

I don't think Java could do it better since it took more time for rendering a same dynamic JSP page and connecting to MySQL in my previous testing.
Don't think dynamic languages are always slow than static languages, you'll find the answer when you need dynamic features.

In my opinion, Java is almost the worst choice which makes everything much much more complex (normally 10x code lines), uses much much more memories (normally 3x memory usage), and also takes much much more money to buy suitable servers.

I've been a Java coder for years, I couldn't find any interesting of it.
The only superiority of Java coders I found was coming from the performance of toy programs. Otherwise, I can't explain why your friend likes complaining by using "shit" while Pythoners don't.

est

2011-01-03 11:19:06 +08:00

At least python doesn't use \ for namespace delimiter. lol

TheOnly92

2011-01-03 11:22:06 +08:00

Just choose the language that will let you get things done, that's all.

ayanamist

2011-01-03 11:42:25 +08:00

按这人的逻辑，所有的动态语言都是垃圾了……
貌似在他眼里，只有C/C++才是王道了。
其实要看具体应用的，动态语言的开发效率不是静态语言能比拟的

CupTools

2011-01-03 11:45:30 +08:00

@ayanamist 他玩PHP/C/C++/ASM

fanix

2011-01-03 12:02:13 +08:00

最后一段说得还是对的，语言不重要，你才重要

hanfeizi

2011-01-03 13:48:33 +08:00

看不懂英文。。

francis

2011-01-03 15:13:26 +08:00

重点在于，用Py的人鄙视PHP也不是一次两次了，还好已经习惯了……

ayanamist

2011-01-03 15:25:54 +08:00

@francis PHP有很多地方让人不爽的……某从PHP跳到Python后深深的感到Python的好，PHP的丑陋

fsw90628

2011-01-03 16:23:58 +08:00

机器编译的速度慢容易弥补，写代码的速度慢很难弥补。

harryxu

2011-01-04 21:19:17 +08:00

@ayanamist 话说Python的确很不错，但是我觉得php也没什么丑的，2个语言风格不太一样，但是写起来感觉都挺爽

AntiGameZ

2011-01-05 06:02:08 +08:00

我觉得这人说的话并不是在贬低python或者php吧

reus

2011-01-07 21:30:42 +08:00

php有trait，python有么？（找茬来的

keakon

2011-01-07 22:00:53 +08:00

@reus 首先确认你问的是不是这个： http://wiki.php.net/rfc/traits

粗略看了下，类似于Ruby的mixin。

A Trait is a unit of reuse much like a class, but only intended to group functionality in a fine-grained and consistent way.
Python是支持多继承的，所以没有traits。

简单来说，这个问题好比拿了台手机，然后问别人你的电脑键盘可以敲3下2打出个c么？

cellsea

2011-01-15 03:42:33 +08:00

我还是不在乎你的女朋友比我的女朋友漂亮/跑得快。

itommy

2011-01-15 06:05:34 +08:00

@francis @ayanamist 说话者没有贬低任何一种他提到的language...

reus

2011-05-01 19:03:32 +08:00

@keakon http://web.cecs.pdx.edu/~black/publications/TR_CSE_02-012.pdf 请阅读此论文并自行判断，我的理解是这个是比mixin和多继承更好用的实现代码复用的机制

xatest

2011-05-01 19:30:49 +08:00

快有2种：开发效率高和执行效率高~
Python属于前者，C/C++属于后者~
对于一个实际项目，语言选择最好是采用上动下静这样的体位~

xatest

2011-05-01 19:32:37 +08:00

补充： http://blog.csdn.net/linkerlin/archive/2011/04/23/6347577.aspx
“体位”一词来自这篇文章~

CupTools

2011-05-07 16:11:58 +08:00

我现在过渡到NodeJS了....
改天玩一下神气haXe

chuck911

2011-05-07 17:15:41 +08:00

shit means thing.
"it's a new shit"

args

2011-05-07 18:18:10 +08:00

除了脏话，说的挺有道理的嘛~

chone

2011-05-07 19:22:53 +08:00

语言争论是没有意义的，完全可以说所有语言都是shit，因为根本不存在一种完全能在任何场合都胜任的语言。语言的好在于它适应了你的需求，脱离了具体的场景去比较是完全没有意义的。

felinx

2011-05-08 09:03:56 +08:00

what's really important is not to choose a language because it is "fast" or not, but choose a language because you "master" it"

看这一句就够了，其它的看了反倒容易造成误解。

summic

2011-05-08 09:36:13 +08:00

＊/＊ is the same shit.

apoclast

2011-05-08 11:00:37 +08:00 via Android

我的疑问是python真的没有字节码优化吗？

jjlovegrape

2011-05-08 11:08:43 +08:00

C++和JAVA基本就是手动档和自动挡的区别。各有各的优势。

MCVector

2011-05-27 14:14:45 +08:00

C/C++, Python, PHP都在学习当中，暂不作评论，感觉各有各的用处